Critique

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Re: Critique

Post by doll_face_ashley » Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:38 pm

Marji4x wrote:Oh man, way to go! Sorry I spoke as someone who has limited experience as an inker XD

Then again, if we had more of you, we would have the kind of staff I was talking about I guess :)
Guess it's time for me to gather up the cleanup staff, give 'em some paper, and poke 'em in the rear! XD

Course I shouldn't be talking cuz my current scene has blowed me out completely. It'll get done I promise...
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Re: Critique

Post by ecco » Sat Sep 19, 2009 6:04 am

AmySFX wrote:@Ecco While if you do have a good point, it still seems like the character in the hunting scene are kinda floating around. Now, the opening shot looks really good! Things look all right until the wolves are have corner off one of the elks. They might look more cemented as you guys develop the scenes.
i can understand what you mean. its odd though, given that the tehcnique doesnt vary throughout the scene yet the believability of how "grounded" they are can still change. :P it may well be for lack of shading/shadows, thats the first thing that comes to mind anyway. but yes we are goingback to it at some point i think so hopefully we can improve on it then. =]

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Re: Critique

Post by x.Tarkah.x » Sat Sep 19, 2009 8:14 pm

AmySFX wrote: The backgrounds don't really seem to fit in with the style of Wolf. They are overly detailed for an animated feature. It's like when they add a live-action explosion to southpark. It simply doesn't fit. (it works for Southpark because it's lulz)
lol really? and the whole time i thought my bg's weren't detailed enoughs.
well in that case time to get lazy muaha. >=D

well to be honest I could be waay more detailed with the backgrounds. And you'll probably see that at different shots there will be a discrepancy with detailing.

Longer appearing shots would contain a little more detail than flash by shots.

Though i do tend to have this problem where i place details in spots where it does not belong, and take away from places that should.

Some Bg's will change though, as I tend to go back and go "ew" and decide to swipe it clean and edit :razz2:
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Re: Critique

Post by AmySFX » Sat Sep 19, 2009 9:11 pm

I wish I knew a background animator, but alas I know SFX peeps. So I can only be so useful on the subject matter.

but I can help you with weather, props and shadows. XD

@Marji I tend to get around. I've met Bruce Smith, the lead animator of Dr. Facilier and creator of the Proud Family, and got to talk to him about random stuff. I've also had the honor of meeting the director of anatomy for Bolt and Balto, Stuart Sumida. I've met the director of SFX for Princess and the Frog, Dan Lund and my mentor is also a SFX from the studios. I've met them all at animation conferences like SIGGRAPH and RedStick. They're all super.

I think the only animator I've met that I didn't like was Mark Simon. He's very aloof and grumpy. DX
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Re: Critique

Post by Biscuit » Mon Sep 21, 2009 6:23 am

Yeei! xD
Time to post my critique on the Scene 2: Rough cut... *shudders* I've already posted this at YT, but still...
Okay here goes:
This is truly amazing... I've watched it over and over again, and I think I even commented before xD Hope you don't mind ;)
Please don't mark me as a critical jerk for this :C

0:04 - Very neat, but the elks are slowing down at the end.
0:25-0:32 - I bet you know about this one; He looks kind of... sliding xD

0:42 - I don't think you need those transparen inbetween frames, since the rest dosen't have those. That's just me though ;)
1:30 - Maybe lighten up the bc a bit? It's hard to see Janus' face properly.
1:56 - I think this needs to be redrawn. It's amazing, don't get me wrong, but something doesen't seem right about the mouth. THERE! I'm done ranting xD


Hooray :cheese:
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Re: Critique

Post by fastenjaw » Mon Oct 12, 2009 12:40 pm

There is a trick to avoiding the floating issue. You animate the character on the foreground without moving it. When you are truly finished with the cleaned and colored animation, you merge the character over the foreground and save this separately. Make sure to keep an unmerged animation and the foreground as well so you can correct artistic errors later. Then when it comes time to move the floor, you can slide the foreground and any subsequent background layers behind that without getting the floating effect. This way you don't have to blindly paste the character over the moving surface while the character itself is moving.
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Re: Critique

Post by Uzuri » Mon Oct 12, 2009 12:45 pm

The floating issue was %100 due to the fact that our process wasn't defined, and we weren't working properly with the backgrounds. The issue isn't there any more; it's solved in the scenes we're working on now.
Zib, go suffer for your art.

Wait. 20 and 20 and 20 is not 50!

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There's a difference between the Electric Slide and a ballet.

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Re: Critique

Post by stenseng » Thu Nov 12, 2009 3:40 pm

stenseng comes to ruin the happyness again!

I've watched scene 2 again, and I thiiink I found something...
It annoys me that it looks like some movements have A LOT .. fewer/less drawings that other movements...
To make a nice but still smooth animation you should play 24 drawings EACH SECOUND! When you do that , you have almost surely got a very very nice animation.

Also something that annoys me (I don't think I have mentioned it before?) is the perspective.
The elk kick animation at 0:50 (youtube) is very nice. Everyone understands that the elk kicks, and specially when Janus ''ducks'' (a duck haha.. yeah I hope you understand what I mean) after the kick perspective clip.
BUT when you see at 1:40 (you gotta stop right there) you see that Janus's legs and paws is very big. Of course you understands that it is the perspective, but a child, nor a .. newbie? would understand that.

And at last, the background is nice, it doesn't matter if it's detailed or not, BUT! The sky got a very special color in scene2, something that makes the non-shaded chars even flatter. When the sun are red, it shines very very brigth, and when it does shine bright, the shadow is dark and big.

Hope this wasn't way too hard to read.. My bad way of writing english :starlaugh:

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Re: Critique

Post by Uzuri » Thu Nov 12, 2009 3:49 pm

Animation is almost always 12 fps, with exceptions for fast/certain types of movement. Had to convince myself of that once by slowing down Spirit and counting the number of movements in a second. It was 12.

The scene is also incomplete in that the characters will be getting overlays to match the background better. They will not be shaded. This isn't up for debate, and to be frank, I'm tired of hearing about it.

Can't argue with the 1:40 comment; that's on the redo list.
Zib, go suffer for your art.

Wait. 20 and 20 and 20 is not 50!

Most men with nothing would rather protect the possibility of being rich than face the reality of being poor. --from "1776"

There's a difference between the Electric Slide and a ballet.

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Re: Critique

Post by stenseng » Thu Nov 12, 2009 5:55 pm

Either 12 or 24 for dvd animation. That's correct.

I am not saying you need to shade, but think a little of what look you gives to the background.
It's kinda sad that we haven't seen any updates, caus we don't know what you have been improoving.

And by the way, I have herd talking about people who uses flash?
Is that so? That if you really can animate with flash, you are allowed to, or is it just hand animating?

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Re: Critique

Post by Uzuri » Thu Nov 12, 2009 6:08 pm

The flash is used just as if you were animating by hand. None of our stuff is Flash-aided animation.
Zib, go suffer for your art.

Wait. 20 and 20 and 20 is not 50!

Most men with nothing would rather protect the possibility of being rich than face the reality of being poor. --from "1776"

There's a difference between the Electric Slide and a ballet.

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Re: Critique

Post by stenseng » Thu Nov 12, 2009 6:28 pm

Hehh, of course you gotta redraw everything each time..
Good luck with the animating :silversmile:

I'll look out for more small things that can be improoved.. But I guess I wont notice them so fast, since they're often small itty bitty things that doesn't mean very much.

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Re: Critique

Post by Koeyohte » Sun Nov 15, 2009 1:13 am

Never saw this thread... not that I would be of use anyway XD Looks like everyon egot the few things I noticed the most, except the music.

It will have better music in the end right? What is there is merely for show purpose? Many people I know have been able to gloss over the animation and stated that the music was really the biggest thing irking them.... Just wondering ^^

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Re: Critique

Post by stenseng » Sun Nov 22, 2009 6:34 pm

yeah, it's so depressing when it is such awesome animations, but the not-so-well-music .. or at least not matching music, will destroy the aoura in the film.

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Re: Critique

Post by SilverLuna » Wed Nov 25, 2009 1:21 am

The music isn't *that* bad, but it seems to peaceful in Scene 2, like maybe some heavier bass, and louder. Maybe ditch the piano.
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